[Neraphym]

1. This is a fight between animals and humans. This means plants, fungi, and protozoa are in NO way a part of this. Bye bye all dangerous microbial life.

2. High amplitude ultrasonic waves. I'm not 100% sure this would be harmless to us, but it would make the animal's heads explode, because they can hear it and we can't.

3. Large animals are no threat to us, as we have guns to deal with them. Anything bigger than a mouse can be shot and killed by a decent soldier with a gun.

4. Smaller animals that are poisonous can be a threat: spiders, snakes, wasps, etc. This is where our guns fail us, and we are left to rely on AoE weapons. Flamethrowers, chemicals, and biological agents are our best defences against them. Some melee weapons (fly swater) can also be useful here.

5. Fish... stay out of the water! There is no need for us to go inside water. This is dumb, fish can't come out of the water, we can just leave them alone.

6. Harmless insects such as house flies, lightning bugs, and house centipedes are no threat to us. Humans already manufacture large quantities of very effective weapons to combat these creatures: shoes. An insect repellant called 'Off' is a nice touch. Spray it directly on the insect for best results.

7. Burrowing insects such as ants, termites, and some spiders are a problem, as they can hide from us. This is no fun. They are cowards. This is where nukes come in handy... j/k. Chemical gasses can do the job.

8. Hamsters... we're doomed.

[Kaezion]

actually, the starter of this topic said humans vs. all else. "all else" means that dangerous microorganisms are indeed involved.

can you see gamma rays? just because you can't perceive it doesn't mean it can't harm you. besides, ultrasonic waves don't do jack. bats emit them all the time.

and the average citizen doesn't keep a flamethrower or chemical warfare agents in his or her closet. fly swatters don't mean squat against a swarm of bees from a single hive - and think of how many hives there are.

humans just physically can't win against all else - we are powerless to stop them if they started a massive attack on us. but that is precisely why this will never happen - these lesser creatures will never have the intellectual capacity to coordinate themselves and attack us.

[Neraphym]

Hm, looking back I see you are right about him saying 'all else'. Seeing as how we are already at war with microbial life and what not, nothing really changes anyway.

Also, do you have bleanch and ammonia (two very common household items) in your closet? Mix and inhale, I dare you. Actually, don't, I could get in trouble...

[Kaezion]

yes, i forgot that those chemicals can in fact be used dangerously. i guess they'll serve as good weapons. however, they can also harm humans - and this time you'll find it hard to disagree that the average civilian does not have a gas mask handy. wet rags can only be of so much use.

everything would change if microorganisms decided to actually attack us. our current struggle with disease occurs because these lifeforms are only trying to find a suitable habitat - in this case, our bodies. these organisms aren't trying to deliberately harm us; the ONLY thing they are trying to do is survive, and the harm that is inflicted on us is only a by-product of their survival. if they actually focused their efforts on harming us, we wouldn't last a few hours.

[?FaLLeN?]

Being an animal myself i would win so u should add to that poll redhound22 ok

[Neraphym]

Yeah... not everyone has a gas mask. I'd imagine there is quite a large quantity of government surplus and extra's, but not enough for everyone. We'd be stuck with wet rags and trying to avoid the gas we use.

And as for the micros, it's really hard to debate they're abilities. We don't know exactly how they could do anything other than try to survive, because, as you said, that's all they've ever done.

Do you think we should include viruses? They are not scientifically considered to be 'life' as we know it, but in a way, it is. If we were to consider this a part of our enemies, I'd have to say we'd all be screwed (Ebola).

[Kaezion]

actually, your argument does make sense. it's not like diseases that are specific to other animals can affect us. i don't know how exactly the microorganisms' behavior will change, but i can assure you it's going to be for the worse. remember, the premise of this debate is that these organisms are actually smart enough to initiate an attack on humans. if they gained this intelligence, microorganisms surely will find a way to kill us more efficiently.

while the question of the virus being a lifeform remains a topic of debate in science, i think that it is a lifeform; it possesses its own genetic code, and it can replicate itself - a form of reproduction.

[Neraphym]

it can replicate itself - a form of reproduction.

Technically it cannot replicate itself. It forces the host to replicate for it. This is the main reason science doesn't consider it life. In my opinion, I believe that since it is made up of protein and d/rna, replicates (by any means necessary), and has a cool name, it should be considered life. Thus, ebola pwnz us all.

[skenasis]

*suddenly notices direction the argument is going* right, now heres something i can clear up.

oh, and for all you peoples wanting to wipe out microorganisms, i say this: sorry, but we cant survive without them. nuts, eh?

viruses arent considered to be alive because they cannot replicate themselves, as alpha pointed out. and yes, they are mostly made of protein. to be precise, theyre DNA or RNA covered by a protein coat. they invade cells, take them over, then turn the cell into a replicating factory (so to speak). then they chug out the replicates in one of two ways: the new viruses 'bud' out of the cell, so the cell continues to replicate the viruses until its death, which, depending on the cell, can be anywhere from a few days to a few weeks. and so you have thousands of little virus factories floating around in your body. or, the other option, the cell replicates the viruses until it is filled to beyond bursting point, the cell breaks open and dies, and visuses wander off to invade other cells.

the problem with this is that because they hide in our own cells, our immune systems cannot eliminate them. this is why diseases such as malaria run rampant - the only way we can effectivelly (sp?) kill them is by toxic chemicals which kill not only the viruses, but our own cells as well. and even then, if even a single virus cell survives the toxic chemical, it can invade a cell, and, within a few days or even hours, have thousands of copies of itself ready to run rampant. nasty stuff, no?

and lets not forget the humble little bacteria. bacteria is alive, as it CAN replicate itself by binary fission (dont ask - just know it replicates ). bacteria is alive, and so its counted in this argument anyway. but anyway, i think bacteria would be the single greatest threat for one reason - plasmids.

plasmids are circles of dna that float around in the middle of the cell, but heres the catch - bacteria can transfer these plasmids to each other, and even across species. bacteria with antibiotic-and-lord-alone-knows-what-else resistant plasmids survive, replicate, transfer them across species, and suddenly, we cant kill them. e coli, salmonella, hepatitis, anthrax, and heck, why not bubonic plague whilst were at it? add to this what genetic engineering has done, and i think we are - to put it lightly - totally screwed.

[Kaezion]

i may have worded my statement wrongly. as you have pointed out, viruses do depend on other cells for its replication. however, isn't that fact enough to consider it a lifeform? are you saying that, despite the fact that the virus has its own genetic code and replicates in order to preserve its genes - traits seen EXCLUSIVELY in living things - the virus should be categorized as simply a complex molecule rather than as a unique kind of microorganism, possibly a distant relative of the bacteria?

[Neraphym]

It almost impossible to word that statement correctly, so don't sweat it. I have always and will always consider viruses to be life. They are made up of organic substances and have the instict to live. Just because they reproduce in a different way doesn't make them any less alive. All life is interdependant, so to say one thing isn't alive because it relies on another organism to exist is just plain stupid. Scientists need to use logic... desperately.

[Kaezion]

agreed.

[skenasis]

i have to explain further, it would seem.

They are made up of organic substances and have the instict to live.

no. viruses may be composed of organic substances, but they have no living mind. no instinct. they simply exist. outside a cell, viruses are biological molecules called prions. as prions, they dont do anything. they just float away there, until they happen to be taken into a cell. only then are they actually classed as 'viruses'. anyway. so, when the prion is taken into a cell, the cell it is in will take it into its little cell 'stomach', digest the protein coat, and then the viral DNA wanders over to the nucleus, effectivelly (sp?) tricking the cell into replicating the viral DNA rather than its own as it would do to replicate itself.

are you saying that, despite the fact that the virus has its own genetic code and replicates in order to preserve its genes - traits seen EXCLUSIVELY in living things - the virus should be categorized as simply a complex molecule rather than as a unique kind of microorganism, possibly a distant relative of the bacteria?

the virus itself doesnt replicate, and it isnt alive. protein and DNA alone do not compromise a living organism.

[Kaezion]

i have to explain further, it would seem.

They are made up of organic substances and have the instict to live.

no. viruses may be composed of organic substances, but they have no living mind. no instinct. they simply exist. outside a cell, viruses are biological molecules called prions. as prions, they dont do anything. they just float away there, until they happen to be taken into a cell. only then are they actually classed as 'viruses'. anyway. so, when the prion is taken into a cell, the cell it is in will take it into its little cell 'stomach', digest the protein coat, and then the viral DNA wanders over to the nucleus, effectivelly (sp?) tricking the cell into replicating the viral DNA rather than its own as it would do to replicate itself.

are you saying that, despite the fact that the virus has its own genetic code and replicates in order to preserve its genes - traits seen EXCLUSIVELY in living things - the virus should be categorized as simply a complex molecule rather than as a unique kind of microorganism, possibly a distant relative of the bacteria?

the virus itself doesnt replicate, and it isnt alive. protein and DNA alone do not compromise a living organism.

it seems that you have a penchant for taking words too literally. what Alpha Weapon undoubtedly meant by "instinct," is probably better represented by the word "tendency." consider your average non-living material. does it go around converting other objects into replicas of it self? the virus, on the the other hand, although it may not have the ability to self-replicate, DOES perpetuate the creation of its own genetic clones. now, if we disregard method for a second and study only the results, we can actually see no difference between this kind of reproduction and that which individual living cells go through - the end product is that the virus has now multiplied, and so has the living cell.

again, the virus itself doesn't replicate, but instead it tricks others into doing the replication for it. is that not just a different form of reproduction? as i stated before, the end result is the same as if it had replicated itself. and no, the presence of protein and DNA do not entirely comprise an organism; however, if this protein and this DNA somehow allow the virus a means to replicate - even if it is through exploiting other organisms - then i'd say that those strands of DNA encapsulated in protein deserve to be called an organism.

[Darkness]

Denirik... Everyone knows that mosquitos can be hit with .50 cal tank shots, duh.

Lol

Yes, because we are definitely going to shoot our tanks at the mosquitoes

humans because of one reason.....
we have nukes. nuthin more to it

Mhmm, the nukies that kill us tooo!