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Evolution, Intelligent Design, and Creationism

#1 {lang:macro__useroffline}   Neraphym {lang:icon}

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Posted 19 April 2007 - 12:24 AM

I just looked back at the top 5 pages and didn't see anything about this. This suprises me, as this is a huge issue in America. Let's here what we have to say about these theories and whether or not they are valid, fit for science, or fit for school.
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#2 {lang:macro__useroffline}   Aaron {lang:icon}

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Posted 19 April 2007 - 09:05 PM

I honestly think that all theories should be covered and no favor given to a certain one. Let the students decide for themselves what they want to believe. So what if evolution has much scientific evidence? It may be false. So what if intelligent design is based a divine creator? It may be false also. But, either one may be valid.
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#3 {lang:macro__useroffline}   Jake {lang:icon}

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Posted 19 April 2007 - 10:47 PM

I believe in a more "Theistic Evolution" than anything else.
I realize that evolution is full of holes.
I realize that the bible has been heavily screwed with by the catholic church.
I also realize that much of the bible has been lost in translation.


As such I have come up with my own ever changing beliefs idea as to how we came about.

To put it simply, I believe that we were created by God. But I do not believe that it is God's "style" (for lack of a better non-cliche word) to simply say... "Hmmm... I think I'm going to create the universe today, but... I'm going to take 7 earth days of the 21st century standard to make it." *universe*


I could get more in depth and clarify certain things, but I doubt anybody really wants to hear me ramble on about it bluetongue.gif




But when it comes to school. At the age that evolution is taught most students don't realize that it is just a theory. Not scientific law.
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#4 {lang:macro__useroffline}   Neraphym {lang:icon}

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Posted 19 April 2007 - 11:12 PM

I do. Shoot!
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#5 {lang:macro__useroffline}   Darkness {lang:icon}

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Posted 20 April 2007 - 02:06 AM

QUOTE(Jake @ Apr 19 2007, 03:47 PM) {lang:macro__view_post}
"I'm going to take 7 earth days of the 21st century standard to make it." *universe*

Actually, it wasn't judged to be seven days on earth (by the 21st century standard) that he made the universe. One thousand years on Earth is one single day for God, in heaven. So you could say that for him, it took seven days. But from our viewpoint, it took seven thousand years. Six thousand, actually, since on the last day he rested XD







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#6 {lang:macro__useroffline}   Phieta {lang:icon}

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Posted 20 April 2007 - 03:20 AM

QUOTE(Jake @ Apr 19 2007, 03:47 PM) {lang:macro__view_post}
But when it comes to school. At the age that evolution is taught most students don't realize that it is just a theory. Not scientific law.


Actually, a "theory," in the scientific sense, is something that is generally accepted as true based on the evidence we have, but cannot be explicitly proven.

Gravity is just a theory. grnwink.gif
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#7 {lang:macro__useroffline}   Neraphym {lang:icon}

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Posted 20 April 2007 - 04:43 AM

I thought gravity was a law. Oh well, either way, we really need to teach the scientific method. So here goes: (I'm cramming a few steps together for simplicity's sake.)


Step 1: Observation - - - You observe something happening and you don't know why.

Step 2: Hypothesis - - - You formulate an educated and informed idea based on these observations in order to explain it, and predict similar events.

Step 3: Test - - - Perform a test to see if the hypothesis works. If it does, yay! If not, then your hypothesis needs modifying.


If your hypothesis works, then you go and publish it to be reviewed by other scientists. If enough people support you hypothesis as correct, it becoems scientific theory. If something is a theory, odds are, it's VERY good at explaining and predicting the outcomes. When poeple say "evolution is just a theory," they don't quite understand what a theory is. They are actually taking a positive stance on evolution, when in reality, they are probably trying to say "evolution is just a hypothesis." Unfortunately, their misuse of the word is actually leading to the popular misconception that theories are weak.


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#8 {lang:macro__useroffline}   Atilla {lang:icon}

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Posted 20 April 2007 - 06:00 AM

QUOTE(Phieta @ Apr 19 2007, 09:20 PM) {lang:macro__view_post}
Gravity is just a theory. grnwink.gif

And the fifth dimension in theory too.

Time is the fourth. bluetongue.gif
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#9 {lang:macro__useroffline}   ©allum {lang:icon}

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Posted 20 April 2007 - 06:38 AM

QUOTE(Darknessâ„¢ @ Apr 20 2007, 02:06 PM) {lang:macro__view_post}
QUOTE(Jake @ Apr 19 2007, 03:47 PM) {lang:macro__view_post}
"I'm going to take 7 earth days of the 21st century standard to make it." *universe*

Actually, it wasn't judged to be seven days on earth (by the 21st century standard) that he made the universe. One thousand years on Earth is one single day for God, in heaven. So you could say that for him, it took seven days. But from our viewpoint, it took seven thousand years. Six thousand, actually, since on the last day he rested XD


Where does it say 1000 years = 1 Godday? Wouldn't time be irrelevant to an omnipotent god?
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#10 {lang:macro__useroffline}   Jake {lang:icon}

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Posted 20 April 2007 - 09:17 PM

That's basically my point thumb.gif

------------------------------------

Well... to over simplify my beliefs since I'm to lazy/have a hard time explaining ideas.

I believe that god doesn't just magic things into existence. I also believe in evolution as being ... for lack of a better way of saying this... God's way of creating life. Just the same as I believe that the universe wasn't simply magicked into existence either.
I'm not one of those people that take the bible too literally actually. Maybe that makes me a "bad christian" but I know too much about what the catholic church used to do to simply blindly accept what they say/said. (I'm protestant anyways bluetongue.gif )

I don't claim to know all (if any) answers, but my whole faith isn't based around how the world came about either. If I'm wrong (1:1,000,000,000 odds that I'm right anyways) I don't really care. In my eyes everybody's wrong anyways. Sure, there are some people that have good ideas out there, but chances are that they're wrong.
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#11 {lang:macro__useroffline}   Aaron {lang:icon}

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Posted 21 April 2007 - 02:50 AM

Jake, I believe the Deist views that you express are feasible. I personally believe God has left the Earth to do things on its own for the most part, but I do believe he is active on Earth in people's lives and the like.
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#12 {lang:macro__useroffline}   Rohtaren {lang:icon}

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Posted 23 April 2007 - 08:26 PM

evolution is a fake. it would be very rare that good mutations occur.

QUOTE
an animal or other organism can't decide what type of shape it will have when it is born.
example, the woodpecker couldn't decide when it first died of banging its beak on the bark of a tree that it would have a really hard beak or special tendons in the back of its head for support before it was born again... or whatever.


besides, what is the probablitity that two organisms (of the opposite gender from each other) that have the same mutations (which is also rare) would meet each other, mate, and manage to not kill each other because they might be from waring groups or some other thing like that.

i think that slight amounts of evolution could be possible, like 1000 years ago, the average height was shorter that it is now. people also generally live longer now than they used too.<oops, that could be a result of medical improvement, sorry, but the height doesn't count in that field.

big bang is also fake. where did the particles that came together and created the big bang come from? hmm? thats a very good point that i think wasn't thought through when those silly scientists were coming up with the big bang theory.
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#13 {lang:macro__useroffline}   Atilla {lang:icon}

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Posted 23 April 2007 - 10:21 PM

QUOTE(Rohtaren @ Apr 23 2007, 02:26 PM) {lang:macro__view_post}
evolution is a fake. it would be very rare that good mutations occur.

Well under that statement, evolution is very rare. Choose your words carefully in a debate. grnwink.gif

And mutation is not to be compared with evolution, as mutation is rapid change.

Taken directly from dictionary.com:

QUOTE
mu·ta·tion /myuˈteɪÊÆ’Éâ„¢n/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[myoo-tey-shuhn] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun
1. Biology.
a. a sudden departure from the parent type in one or more heritable characteristics, caused by a change in a gene or a chromosome.


Evolution occurs over millions of years, and is therefore forced to reject old testament creationism as it states the earth was created 6000 years ago.
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#14 {lang:macro__useroffline}   Neraphym {lang:icon}

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Posted 24 April 2007 - 01:07 AM

If evolution is fake, then explain the existence of bacteria that can eat nylon. Nylon was synthetically created in a lab back in ww2. It does not occur naturally under any circumstances.
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#15 {lang:macro__useroffline}   ©allum {lang:icon}

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Posted 24 April 2007 - 04:24 AM

In summary: Evolution is dark sided. Only gargoyles and psychics believe it.
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